[Pharo-project] web site relocation Re: Newbie observations on use of Metacello
Ben Coman
btc at openInWorld.com
Wed Dec 21 15:56:58 CET 2011
Thanks for the tip. I was aware of the rename to DBXTalk, but not the
change to ConfigurationOfOpenDBXDriver.
The new site [1] says "Welcome to SqueakDBX", and [2] refers only to
ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX.
Further offtopic but perhaps of interest to others...
The DBXTalk site was difficult to find. For me google results only show
it on the second page. I lament for your sake the loss of the
squeakdbx.org domain. You may have had better better results holding on
to it for a couple of years coupled with a 301 redirect [3][4]. As well
as losing the immediate redirects from the existing links on other web
sites, including your own [5], the cybersquatter now on squeakdbx.org
may compromise the ranking of your new site, along with additional
"content duplication/spam" reasons discussed at [3].
[1] http://dbxtalk.smallworks.com.ar/
[2] http://dbxtalk.smallworks.com.ar/Installation
[3] http://www.bigoakinc.com/seo-articles/301-direct-Google.php
[4] http://support.google.com/webmasters/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=93633
[5] http://marianopeck.wordpress.com/tag/dbxtalk/
cheers, Ben
Mariano Martinez Peck wrote:
> Hi Ben. Some offtopic, but be aware that ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX is
> deprecated. The whole project has been renamed to DBXTalk and what was
> SqueakDBX is now DBXTalkOpenDBXDriver. You can find
> ConfigurationOfOpenDBXDriver in DBXTalk repo or MetacelloRepository.
>
> On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 6:11 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse at inria.fr
>
>> wrote:
>>
>
>
>> On Dec 19, 2011, at 5:04 PM, Ben Coman wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>>>
>>>> ben thanks for your feedback.
>>>>
>>>> Normally we should use the monticello repository browser and just click
>>>>
>> on a ConfigurationOf
>>
>>> I've been lurking this mail list for 6 - 9 months and had not picked
>>>
>> that up. That is a big miss. I'm not usually so slow. Can you point me to
>> the documentation that describes that process?
>>
>>
>> The problem is that we did not push it to the point the repository for
>> 1.0, contains only 1.0 configuration.
>> We will check that when esteban will arrive.
>>
>>
>>> In the meantime, I unzip a fresh Pharo-1.3-OneClick, open Monticello
>>>
>> Browser and look for ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX. I can't see it. I expected
>> to since you seemed to indicate it was that simple.
>>
>>> So I GUESS* my way through. I <Open> the
>>>
>> http://www.squeaksource.com/MetacelloRepository repository
>>
>>> (which actually requires a bit of fore knowledge about the url - which
>>>
>> not all newbies will have)
>>
>>> This did show ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX but the are many versions and so
>>>
>> many buttons to choose from. A bit scary for a newbie.
>>
>>> Anyhow, I'll ASSUME* to select the latest one
>>>
>> ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX-MarianoMartinezPeck.27 and click <Load>.
>>
>>> I still can't see any SqueakDBX or OpenDBX classes in System Browser.
>>> Do I need to follow up manually doing "ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX project
>>>
>> latestVersion load." ?
>>
>>> A mixed procedure part GUI and part non-GUI is not the best - and I've
>>>
>> not seen it documented anywhere.
>>
>>> I would have liked to have loaded the package with "just a single click
>>>
>> on a ConfigurationOf" but there seems to be more to it than that.
>>
>>> The following still seems easier:
>>>
>>>> Metacello package: 'SqueakDBX' load
>>>>
>>> or perhaps some alternatives using existing tools...
>>> 1. To the Monticello Browser add a <Metacello> button that opens
>>>
>> http://www.squeaksource.com/MetacelloRepository. If Metacello is "THE"
>> package management tool then it should have a higher profile than just one
>> of the 23 listed repositories, of which two others have "Metacello" in
>> their title.
>>
>>> 2. To the World Menu, add a <Metacello Browser> item that jumps straight
>>>
>> to the Monticello Repository Browser for
>> http://www.squeaksource.com/MetacelloRepository.
>>
>>> 3. The Welcome Text of a fresh pharo-oneclick image should describe how
>>>
>> to do either 1. or 2. above.
>>
>>> cheers, Ben
>>>
>>>> than did you read the forthcoming chapter?
>>>> https://gforge.inria.fr/frs/download.php/28462/Metacello.pdf (old
>>>>
>> version)
>>
>>>>
>>> Yes I refer to it in point 4 below. Can you point me to where in that
>>>
>> pdf it specifically describes that loading procedure using Monticello
>> Browser. All the examples I can see are code b> below, except using
>> (Smalltalk at:.....) rather than the class itself.
>>
>>> Further, the Pharo-1.3-OneClick opening documentation says to execute
>>>
>> the following line...
>>
>>>> DEVImageWorkspaces openExternalProjectWorkspace.
>>>>
>>> which shows several examples all of the same form as the code b> below.
>>>
>>> Also, from memory the examples given throughout this mail list tend to
>>>
>> be of the same form as code b> below - rather than directing people to the
>> GUI Monticello Browser - or I probably would have picked that up sooner.
>>
>>>> Stef
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 19, 2011, at 5:15 AM, Ben Coman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Some observations from the perspective of as a newbie on Pharo Package
>>>>>
>> Management. I'm likely to me missing in the philosophy of the design, but
>> from the narrow view of my own usage....
>>
>>>>> 1. When I read about Metacello being the package management system, I
>>>>>
>> expected there to be a "command"(*) Metacallo but instead I see Gopher
>> being used. This is a mixed message that lowers my comfort level feeling
>> I understand the system as I'm trying to pick up a bundle of new ideas. As
>> I now understand it Metacello is more about a system of backend
>> configuration than a front end user interface. I am now more comfortable
>> using Gopher direct - but I reflect on how I felt the first time.
>>
>>>>> (*) While technically a "command" is like a verb, and Gopher is like
>>>>>
>> a noun rather than a verb - I can't yet completely disengage my prior
>> learning that considers the first part of the statement to be a "command" -
>> and I expect other newbies might find the same.
>>
>>>>> 2. The strong convention of naming things ConfigurationOfXXXX is
>>>>>
>> somewhat redundant from a user perspective.
>>
>>>>> 3. If copy-paste into the Workspace from a web site a sample package
>>>>>
>> load (for example b> below) and then highlight the whole thing and execute,
>> it tells me
>>
>>>>> "Unknown variable: ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX, please correct, or
>>>>>
>> cancel" Duh! What? Oh, I need to execute it in two parts. No one wrote
>> that down anywhere....
>>
>>>>> The alternative "(Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX)" adds
>>>>>
>> further complexity in the eyes of a newbie.
>>
>>>>> Based on the above points, it would be nice to have...
>>>>>
>>>>> a> Metacello configuration: 'SqueakDBX' load
>>>>>
>>>>> rather than...
>>>>>
>>>>> b> Gofer new
>>>>> b> squeaksource: 'MetacelloRepository';
>>>>> b> package: 'ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX';
>>>>> b> load.
>>>>> b> ConfigurationOfSqueakDBX project latestVersion load.
>>>>> While only a small saving in typing, I think it significant for
>>>>>
>> newbies in terms of polish and the marketing message that Metacello really
>> is the chosen package management system.
>>
>>>>> A very rough implementation (with much of the syntax likely wrong)
>>>>>
>> might be just...
>>
>>>>> c> Metacello class >> package: aPackage
>>>>> c> | packageConfig |
>>>>> c> packageConfig := 'ConfigurationOf', aPackage;
>>>>> c> Gopher new c> squeaksource:
>>>>>
>> 'MetacelloRepository';
>>
>>>>> c> package: packageConfig
>>>>> c> load
>>>>> c> ^((Smalltalk at: (packageConfig asSymbol))
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Now after I've written the above I contemplate that there must have
>>>>>
>> been an early design decision to not implement a separate Metacello class
>> to avoid duplication/overlap with Monticello. However perhaps now that the
>> system is implemented as it is, a thin shim can be put over the top to
>> assist getting the ConfigurationOfXXX files downloaded. Additional things
>> this Metacello class might later provide: a. Improved reliability by
>> downloading from a system of package repository mirrors. SqueakSource was
>> having some issues and I found [1] a fortunate backup. b. A GUI for
>> browsing package versions
>>
>>>>> c. A GUI for browsing compatibility tables from a continuous
>>>>>
>> integration system that tries different permutations of Montecello packages
>> together.
>>
>>>>> 4. It seems that every ConfigurationOfXXX has its own category in the
>>>>>
>> SystemBrowser. Each of these categories has only one class. This seems to
>> me like unneeded clutter of the System Browser. It would be neater if
>> Metacello specified its configurations to be grouped under a single
>> category "MetacelloConfigurations" or similar.
>>
>>>>> 5. The sample Metacello PBE is very good in the detail for developers
>>>>>
>> to provide configurations. However there is not much directed clearly at a
>> 'mere' user. Even though Smalltalk makes us all developers, newbies all
>> start as mere users while exploring the system. [1] Gofer new url: '
>> http://dsal.cl/squeaksource/MonticelloRedirect'; package:
>> 'MontiRedirect'; load. MRManager redirectFrom: '
>> http://www.squeaksource.com/' to: 'http://dsal.cl/squeaksource/'.
>>
>>>>> Cheers, Ben
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
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